Minutes May 27, 1997 CITY OF DENTON CITY COUNCIL MINUTES
May 27, 1997
After determining that a quorum was present and convening in an
open meeting, the city Council convened in a Closed Meeting on
Tuesday, May 27, 1997 at 5:15 p.m. in the Civil Defense Room of
City Hall.
PRESENT: Mayor Miller; Mayor Pro Tem Brock; Council Members
Beasley, Kristoferson, Cochran, Durrance, and Young.
ABSENT: None
The Council considered the following in Closed Meeting:
Consultation with Attorney -- Under TEX. GOV'T CODE Sec.
551.071
Discussed and considered Sangster and Tetreault
claims growing out of the drowning incident which
occurred at Bell and Robertson Streets in November,
1996.
Conference with Employees -- Under TEX. GOV'T CODE Sec.
551.075. The Council received information from employees
or questioned employees during a staff conference or
briefing, but did not deliberate during the conference.
The Council convened into a Work Session on Tuesday, May 27, 1997
at 6:00 p.m. in the City Council Chambers of City Hall.
PRESENT: Mayor Miller; Mayor Pro Tem Brock; Council Members
Beasley, Kristoferson, Cochran, Durranoe, and Young.
ABSENT: None
Mayor Miller presented a proclamation for "Stand For Healthy
Children Day."
1. The Council received a storm drainage briefing regarding the
following:
Received a report regarding various drainage plans
Received a report, held a discussion and gave staff
direction regarding the Robertson Street drainage
project.
Rick Svehla, Deputy City Manager, stated that the Council had
received drainage plans for Pecan Creek, Cooper Creek and PEC 4
which was a tributary of Pecan Creek. These studies were in the
existing CIP and in the upcoming CIP. The scope of these plans
dealt with the development within the City around and near the
creeks and the difference in the types of crossings for each type
of creek. There were only five major crossings ~f Cooper Cr~k.
These were located at Old North Road, Nottingham, Windsor, Sherman
and Stewart. The existing CIP plan had funding for crossings of
Cooper Creek. The Blue Ribbon Committee combined the money for
those five crossings. The strategy for Cooper Creek was to look at
improving those crossings by looking at ways to detain the water,
slow it down, hold for a while and then let it go slowly out of
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May 27, 1997
Page 2
detention ponds. In effect, temporary lakes would be built. That
approach was used as there was a large portion of the Cooper Creek
watershed which was not developed and the land was available.
That land could be bought or received through development. Pecan
Creek went through the middle of the city. There already were
several retention/detention ponds at North Lakes Park which were
built for flood control. That land was probably the only land left
to build the ponds for flooding as there were no other areas south
of North Lakes to build a large enough pond to help. The strategy
on Pecan Creek was to find ways to enlarge the existing channels.
Both studies dealt with the ultimate design for controlling a
100-year flood. Two other strategies were included in the study.
One was to remove some structures such as buildings in the
floodway. One was bypass solutions which would build a bypass from
one branch of the creek to another. The other possible solution
was closing or removing some structures such as bridges or box
culverts. These were very different strategies. One was to
purchase land, when available, and build structures which would
detain the water and the other was to enlarge existing structures
in order to accommodate the water.
Council Member Young asked if there were any detention ponds
planned for Pecan Creek along Sycamore past Skinner Street.
Svehla replied no that there was not enough room for a pond in that
area.
Council Member Young stated that there was one channel from
Sycamore past the Phoenix Apartments and another from Bradshaw.
What would happen to the area between Bradshaw and the Phoenix
Apartments.
Svehla replied that the main channel was owned by the Housing
Authority. The land on the north side behind the Phoenix
Apartments was owned by the City.
Council Member Young asked about work from Bradshaw to the Phoenix
Apartments.
Svehla replied that work would be done in that area.
Mayor Pro Tem Brock stated that she would have a problem closing
streets as suggested in the studies, she assumed that there was no
way that the increased value of land reclaimed would allow the city
to repay the cost of that reclamation. Even if the City received
an increase in value, it would take a long time to repay. When the
City did such an improvement, private property owners benefited.
She asked if there was any problem with the City making land more
valuable to its owners by these expenditures.
City Attorney Prouty stated that it was true that whenever a public
improvement was done it generally resulted in an increased value of
property. A legal way to handle that was through a drainage fee.
That fee would capture the cost up front. When the improvements
were done, an assessment could be done on a foot front basis. The
City of Denton City Council Minutes
May 27, 1997
Page 3
adjoining property would benefit from the improvements to the
extent that the value increases. A prior Council decided not to
pursue that proposal.
3¸5
Mayor Pro Tem Brock asked if there would be any legal problems
using bond money. Could an argument be made that there was too
much monetary benefit to the property owners.
City Attorney Prouty stated no. Even if a drainage assessment was
done, the assessment could only be up to the maximum value. If
bond funds were used, there was no mechanism for assessing the
value of the improvement. That would have to be done before the
improvement was done.
Svehla replied if the land came out of the flood plain due to the
improvement, the value would increase as would the amount of taxes
to be paid on that property.
Mayor Pro Tem Brock asked if it were possible to pay for these
kinds of improvements from a 4A or 4B sales tax.
City Attorney Prouty stated yes that it could be done with both but
that a 4B sales tax would be a better vehicle. A 4B sales tax was
for those types of improvements such as public improvements.
city Manager Benavides stated that staff was aware that the removal
of structures or the closing of streets was not really a viable
option but was one which needed to be presented to Council.
Svehla stated that the cost estimates for Cooper Creek were $5
million and approximately $21 million for Pecan Creek. That was
before land and engineering and included the removal of some
structures.
Council Member Beasley stated that the total amount of the projects
would increase the further out in years the projects went. If the
problems were going to be solved, a considerable amount of money
would have to be spent. Either a larger bond issue was needed or
another type of funding mechanism.
Council Member Cochran asked if there were federal requirements for
implementing this plan.
Svehla replied that there were no federal requirements to require
the implementation of this plan. Because the City was trying to
build for the ultimate development/runoff and trying to contain
that 100-year storm in the channel, FEMA regulations allowed the
use of all adjacent land. It was estimated that approximately 65
acres would come out of the Cooper Cre~k flood plain and
approximately 200 acres on Pecan Creek. After the improvements
were done, the project would be submitted to FEMA for their
approval that building could take place on the land.
Council Member Cochran asked about other alternatives such as
underground structures.
city of Denton City Council Minutes
May 27, 1997
Page 4
Svehla replied that those were not looked at. They were
possibilities but the Blue Ribbon Committee looked at standard ways
to handle the water. Many large cities had "lakes" underground to
collect the water and slowly release it. That could be done in
Denton but would be much more expensive.
Council Member Cochran stated that he was concerned about the
street closings and moving homes, etc. He was also concerned about
the concrete lined channels going through the community. He asked
if the study considered only the efficient method of handling the
water and not necessarily the aesthetics of handling the water.
Svehla replied that the studies looked at the traditional ways that
drainage projects were handled and ways to efficiently slow down
the water. Both studies mentioned that there were alternatives to
concrete lining. By making a project aesthetically pleasing, there
was a large effect on the flow of water.
Council Member Kristoferson asked if there would be any negative
effects if Pecan Creek were done on a CIP plan with only small
portions done at a time.
Svehla stated that it could be done a little at a time but the
project would have to start at the downstream end. Pecan Creek
started at Woodrow Lane as downstream from there there was no
development.
Mayor Pro Tem Brock indicated that at times there was the need to
slow the water down as there was the impact of upstream ditches
pouring water into the channels with nothing to slow the water
down. If the project was started downstream, then would the water
be poured out somewhere else such as on an undeveloped area. Would
that cause trouble with the people who owned that land.
Svehla replied no that it would not cause a problem as the flood
plain was already there. For a 100-year storm, there was really no
way to slow the water down from falling from the sky. When some of
the water slowed down because the channel was too small, the rest
of the water behind did not slow down and ran over the top of the
slower water.
Mayor Miller indicated that Denton had not really experienced a
100-year flood.
Svehla replied correct.
Mayor Miller stated that the City needed to deal with the flooding
problem over the next several years. He aske~ if there were other
areas in Denton which were lesser problems or would all of the
problems be solved if Pecan Creek and Cooper Creek were taken care
of.
Svehla replied that Hickory Creek was a third creek in the area but
the majority of that was south of Denton with some tributaries
here. There were localized drainage structures on Hickory Creek
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May 27, 1997
Page 5
which dealt with that drainage. There was a 1989 study which
talked about the concept of ponds in the Ranch Estates area.
Council Member Young stated that no one wanted to raise taxes but
more money was needed to be allocated for drainage. He felt that
$1 million a year needed to be allocated just for drainage because
bridge maintenance was allocated of the drainage money. He
challenged staff to find that million dollars. He felt that the
City did not have proper drainage off the streets.
Mayor Miller stated that in the 1998-99 CIP there was over $2
million for drainage. Other means for funding drainage would have
to be found as the City was currently spending over $1 million a
year for drainage. $1 million would be $.05 on the tax rate. It
was going to take a real commitment to address the problem.
Council Member Young stated that the Mayor was counting money spent
with the CIP. He was suggesting spending $1 million through the
General Fund for drainage. The priorities in the budget were wrong
and there was a need to trim and cut in different areas to come up
with the million dollars.
Mayor Miller stated that there was a total community to provide
services for and everyone needed to remember where the dollars
would come from.
B. Robertson Street
Rick Svehla, Deputy City Manager, stated that several months ago
staff discussed with Council a Robertson Street proposal.
Originally the project looked at a way to go around the railroad
overpass. As the Utility Department needed to do work in the area,
a choice could be made to either bore under Bell Avenue or do an
open cut for the piping. The open cut of the street was appealing
as the bore would cost approximately $200,000 which was much more
than open cutting. When culverts were built, the longer they were,
the more efficient they were. That being the case, it would make
sense to extend the channel across Bell Avenue to Robertson Street.
With that proposal, there would be a problem with some of the fire
trucks from Central being able to go under the overpass. If the
project was started at the bottom of the channel and proceeded in
a straight line, the channel would be lower at the underpass. With
this new design, more money was needed for the project. Originally
there was $200,000 in the CIP for the Robertson Street culvert.
The Utility Department would save approximately $200,000 with this
open cut design and was willing to lend that money for the project.
Added to that would be $100,000 which was designated in the first
year of the CIP for work to be done at Good Samaritan. Since the
CIP was approved, the owner of Good Samaritan built additional
improvements and paid for part of those drainage improvements so
that there was approximately $100,000 left over from that project.
The original recommendation was for $500,000 for the project which
was $200,000 of original money, $200,000 from Utilities, and
$100,000 from left over Good Samaritan money. Council had a long
discussion regarding the extension of Scott Street with a decision
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City of Denton City Council Minutes
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Page 6
not to spend all of the money on Scott Street but to use some of
that money on the Robertson Street drainage project. Those funds
were approximately $110,000. since that time, the Community
Development Advisory Committee recommended additional funding for
Lakey Street and funding for a Bradshaw crossing in the amount of
$340,000. Approximately $1.266 million was in the CIP for the
Bradshaw channel from Bradshaw to the main channel plus $1 million
for Bradshaw upstream for channel work. It was suggested to the
Oversight Committee and recommended by the Committee to move that
money up in the CIP. Debt service would have to be paid early.
Bonds could be sold next year and have $1.266 million to use for
the project. It would cost approximately $165,000 extra to move
those funds up in the CIP which was not budgeted. All of the
available money was approximately $2.2 million. It was felt that
if all of the projects were bid together such as Skinner Street,
Lakey Street, the Bradshaw crossing, the Robertson Street underpass
and the $1 million for channel work, economies of scale would be
received and the channel work could be done for approximately $1
million. $2.2 million of engineering costs would be added which
would not cover the ground needed and had no contingency funds. It
was felt that 10% was needed for contingency. The Oversight
Committee originally recommended the entire project starting
downstream and going upstream to Bell. $165,000 would have to be
found to move up the bonds and $235,000 for contingency. The
Drainage Subcommittee looked at ways to find more money for the
project. It was suggested that perhaps more bond money could be
moved up. In the last year of the CIP, there was $574,000 in
miscellaneous money. If $270,000 of the miscellaneous money was
moved up and the bonds sold early, it would cost $40,000. The
whole need would be all bond money moved up which would add $40,000
to the $165,000 for a total of $205,000. If Council went in that
direction, there would still be some hurdles to get past. The
engineering costs would be approximately $216,000. There was money
in the Robertson Street account and leftover money from the Good
Samaritan project in the amount of $300,000. That would allow the
engineering work to begin before December, the ultimate set of
plans would be completed and bids could be let for the project.
Council Member Young asked about the starting date of the project
and the projected time for the project to be completed.
Svehla stated that the engineering phase could be started soon and
by November 1st or December 1st, the plans would be ready for bid.
It would take approximately 12-18 months to build the full project.
Council Member Young left the meeting.
Council Member Beasley stated that if the cost estimates were too
low for the project, where would the extra money come from. Sh~
did not want to get into the project and not be able to do all of
the project.
Svehla stated that the engineering plans would remain good. The
project would start at the bottom end of the channel and move
upstream which could be done in parts if necessary.
City of Denton City Council Minutes
May 27, 1997
Page 7
Brock motioned, Beasley seconded to proceed as suggested by staff
in the back-up materials.
Council Member Durrance stated that he was concerned about the
financial aspect of the project. Although he had some
reservations, he felt the project was moving in the right
direction.
City Manager Benavides stated that if Council moved forward with
the engineering, by the time Council considered the budget, there
would be an idea of the financial situation and other funding
options could be presented.
On roll vote, Beasley "aye", Kristoferson "aye", Cochran "aye",
Durrance "aye", Brock "aye" and Mayor Miller "aye". Motion carried
unanimously.
2. The Council received a report, held a discussion and gave
staff direction regarding fiber optics contracts with the Denton
Independent School District, Texas Woman's university and
University of North Texas.
Bob Nelson, Executive Director for Utilities, stated that over the
last several years, the City developed an extensive fiber optic
system. Three other agencies in the City were interested in using
some of that system.
Sharon Mays, Director of Electric Utilities, stated that the first
project dealt with the DISD to use the City's linkage for their
computers at all of their schools. The DISD had asked for a
contract which would link all 21 DISD facilities, 9 in the first
year by August and the remainder in the 1998-99 school year. The
second project was a partnership with UNT. This would be an
extension of a long relationship with the university. By providing
fiber optics to the university, the city would be able to do water
quality monitoring where the outfall from the water treatment plant
entered Lake Lewisville. The City and TWU already had a fully
developed fiber system and no additional projects were seen at this
point in time. Staff was asking for Council approval to move ahead
in the development of an interlocal agreement with UNT and DISD.
Kristoferson motioned, Cochran seconded to proceed with the
contracts with the DISD, TWU and UNT. On roll vote, Beasley "aye",
Kristoferson "aye", Cochran "aye", Durrance "aye", Brock "aye" and
Mayor Miller "aye". Motion carried unanimously.
3. The Council received a report, held a discussion and gave
staff direction regarding a timetable for Board/Commission
appointments.
Jennifer Walters, City Secretary, presented the timetable as shown
in the agenda back-up materials.
Consensus of the Council was to proceed with the schedule.
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City of Denton City Council Minutes
May 27, 1997
Page 8
With no further business, the meeting was adjourned at 8:30 p.m.
J~NNI~R WALTERS
~TY SECRETARY
CITY OF DENTON, TEXAS
CITY OF DENTON, TEXAS
ACC0038F